John Kricfalusi and the old retro boom.
I’ve written often about the undeniable, larger than life influence John Kricfalusi had on me and the cartoon industry, but obviously not enough. I think it’s clear to anyone who pays attention to such things that John’s style of storytelling and animation paved the way for the biggest hits (like Spongebob Squarepants) of the last silver age of cartoons. But it’s less known that his love for the great graphic cartoon designs of the late 50s, and the merchandise spawned from it, has influenced tons of illustrative and sculptural artists too. John’s enjoyment of off-model, happy accidents, his admiration of the dozens of unsung, quality artists who participated in merchandising is legend among those who know him.
In fact, when we first met in 1992, John was excitedly telling me that Hanna-Barbera just had to license do with his vision of the art. I agreed and we licensed the first such stuff (like the great paint kit) to him and his future partner.
The great thing I see in this generation is that almost every artist and creator of the generation that came of age in the 90s has acknowledged John, both if they’re lucky enough to speak in public, and certainly in everyday conversation. Everyone thanks John and understands that without him our newest generation would’ve had a harder time getting heard and seen. Thanks bud.
»
On November 2nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
why are you trying to foster this “new generation” of artists who seem to be merely attempting to copy the masters, instead of putting your money towards the masters themseleves(especially John K) who will definitely make something great and original? is it because you can get these nubies to make cartoons cheaply? well if the price john k gives you for a masterpiece is higher it’s probably because he is speaking from experience and is giving you a realistic figure to make a top quality product. and if any of these new generation cartoonists actually make something that people like they’ll probably ditch your ass in 1/24th of a second.
On November 2nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
All I can do is my best akira. I’ll keep trying.
On November 2nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
Hold on to your seat, Fred, because here come the John K. clones to regurgitate his self-promoting blather.
On November 2nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
hi todd, are you talking about me? Do you even know what a clone is? well then i’ll call you a retard because it means a person of low IQ. Why don’t you try to argue a specific point you disagree with rather than dismiss anything and everything associated with a guy whose talent you are probably jealous of.
in my previous comment i was saying that it would be smarter for a man with money, who wants to make more of it, to invest in the original, and continually innovating John K. rather than the people who are satisfied to simply rip his or other people’s stuff off, often unsuccessfully. The fact that John K has a fan base shouldn’t be seen as a negative factor, nor should his history with Nickelodon cartoons(if anything Nick should be paying reparations for that debacle).
One great cartoon is better than a hundred mediocre ones. try harder, fred, PLEASE!(and thanks for caring)
On November 2nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
akira: What do you do when all the masters have gone? We need a new generation of artists to keep the tradition going, rather than relining on those who are already masters of the art.
On November 2nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
dude, obviously there will be more than just John K’s cartoons being made. But, also, if he had a cartoon studio cranking out toons, he would be passing on his knowledge to all the artists working for him, as he has always done(I won’t even try to begin listing the spumco alumni.)
your arguement only strengthens my point. I guess picasso should have stopped at 40 and let other younger artists do work to fill the galleries, huh? (is jerry beck too old to direct cartoons or is it just important to have no experience?)
yes obviously i am a john k fan and it just frustrates me that John wants to make more cartoons and even seemingly sensible guys with money like fred seibert seem to have no faith in a proven entity.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
akira, the problem is that all John does is make cartoons about people having sex, and really that’s not marketable in mainstream television yet. Sure it will be eventually as our society gets further and further down in to the cesspools of hell but for now, you can SELL sex on tv the way he does it. You can’t SELL weirdness and awkwardness and sexual innuendos in cartoons because the average Joe from Kansas could give crap about cartoons anyway, and that’s all who is allowed to see it. Boobs? Sure! Sex? Sure! Gayness? Yup! In a kids show? Not yet! Cartoons are still primarily for kids and kids can’t watch sex(yet). Yes John has quite a bit to give the animation community but let’s be real, he is rapidly approaching one-hit-wonder status. What he should do if he truly cares about the animation, as he drones on day after day about on his blog medium is open a school where he can teach the philosophies he has learned over the years. I am quite sure that would fill 4 years of college. Instead he whines on his blog that he never gets a fair shake telling everyone he’s great and cronies like you patronize him for it. You need money to make animation and if you can’t have money then you need great ideas… John started out with a great idea. Ren and Stimpy? Genius! But nothing else has come close. He needs to listento himself and find out what ‘character’ truly means. John needs to show these great ideas if he has any, and if they are actually great Fred, or Disney or Cartoon Network or any other network would line up to buy them but he has not proven himself to have these great ideas and no one should get free money. You know who does have the really good ideas that kids connect with? Young adults! That’s why people hire them… not because they work for cheap wages. Yeah, amazing as it seems they actually GET kids because they were just recently ones themselves.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
you’re silly! first of all john doesn’t only make cartoons about sex. if you’re talking about “adult party ren and stimpy” or the new tenacious D video, I believe he was following orders to make stuff specifically not for kids. i wish boo boo gone wild was out on dvd so i could tell you to go watch that, but i’m pretty sure john has several ideas that don’t involve sex. of the pitches he’s mentioned on his blog, i personally would most like to see “Kaspar the Unfriendly Bear” get greenlit. but i bet the pitch he developed with Katie Rice (might fit age requirements) would be pretty successful, too. well i can see what you’re saying about having someone who is in touch with the younger generation actually writing all of the shows they watch… it kind of makes sense except that the young generation in america right now is totally bland! if you got your wishes we’d have all our cartoons about playing video games, hanging out in daycare, surfing the internet and getting into wacky situations where they can use all the street knowledge that they learned from downloading rap mp3s.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
LOL Yeah I guess you are right in some ways. It has to be balanced. I have seen the Boo Boo film and I really didn’t see the marketability of it and apparently neither did CN because that’s the last stuff he did for them I think. I believe that John is good at what he does for sure but I think that what he does is not for mainstream and there just aren’t that many outlets for him to go. It’s all still about making money and sure we can say “Man that sucks! Those money grubbing bastards!” but if no one likes what they put on they have no network to put stuff on at all. The truth is that if John created a show that someone liked it would be bought. that’s just how it works. But then, seeing as how I am a moron what do I know? And thank you by the way for responding politely instead of calling me names for my view on things.
On November 2nd, 2006 at 12:00 am
Amen, Todd!
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
@Asymetrical mind
>akira, the problem is that all John does is >make cartoons about people having sex, and >really that’s not marketable in mainstream >television yet.
Here goes again the generalizations and preconcieved opinons about John and his work…
>Sure it will be eventually as our society >gets further and further down in to the >cesspools of hell but for now, you can SELL >sex on tv the way he does it.
I´m sorry, but you sound like a total moron. The only thing which drives western society down the drain, including animation, is the celebration of ignorance and total lack of will to achieve something great anymore. Badly drawn cartoons, imitating the mistakes of each other, with no real concept behind it to amaze and catch the audience anymore. That is what John is fighting against. Yes, John does many sexual references in his cartoons, so what? Is THAT ALONE an indication how good/bad these cartoons are? How good the craftsmanship is? No.
>You can’t SELL weirdness and awkwardness and >sexual innuendos in cartoons because the >average Joe from Kansas could give crap >about cartoons anyway, and that’s all who is >allowed to see it.
Oh no, another one who thinks cartoons are primarily aimed at children. Yes you are right, no full grown man/woman would watch the crap that is airing on TV nowadays. But not because they are cartoons, they won´t watch them because they are unfunny. There was a time when cartoons used to be entertainment primarily for youngsters and adults. Other countries like Japan think the same way. Yes you are right, western culture is really going downhill.
>Boobs? Sure! Sex? Sure! Gayness? Yup! In a >kids show? Not yet! Cartoons are still >primarily for kids and kids can’t watch >sex(yet).
So, you would suggest John to abadon his own ideas like the rest of all, sell himself out and go with the flow of producing uninteresting crap, right? If no one bothers to make a change, how is a change supposed to happen?
>Yes John has quite a bit to give the >animation community but let’s be real, he is >rapidly approaching one-hit-wonder status. >What he should do if he truly cares about >the animation, as he drones on day after day >about on his blog medium is open a school >where he can teach the philosophies he has >learned over the years. I am quite sure that >would fill 4 years of college. Instead he >whines on his blog that he never gets a fair >shake telling everyone he’s great and >cronies like you patronize him for it.
Funny, you say John has quite a bit to give to the animation community, you even pretend to agree that he should teach fellow animation students, yet you denounce him, his fans, his ideas and his work here. What a hypocritical game are you playing here? I´d say you actually never bothered to read his blog, otherwise, you wouldn´t spread such vicious lies here.
>You need money to make animation and if you >can’t have money then you need great >ideas… John started out with a great idea. >Ren and Stimpy? Genius! But nothing else has >come close.
Aha, who has great ideas automatically recieves the money to realize this ideas. How naive can you be? And to go with it, you blindly follow the judgement of studio/network executives, the people who have the money.
>He needs to listento himself and find out >what ‘character’ truly means.
I doubt that you even come close to his and other people´s understanding of “character”, as you nicely put it.
>John needs to show these great ideas if he >has any, and if they are actually great >Fred, or Disney or Cartoon Network or any >other network would line up to buy them
LOL! Yes, networks and studios are just lining up to try innovative and daring ideas! Man, you are so naive. You have absolutely NO CLUE.
>he has not proven himself to have these >great ideas and no one should get free >money.
Free money means recieving money without the work behind it. So you accuse him of being a lazy bum. If you want to see lazy bums in animation, recieving lots of money, watch SOUTH PARK or FAMILY GUY.
Again, so great, you pretend to credit him for his knowledge, yet you continue to denounce this man here.
>You know who does have the really good ideas >that kids connect with? Young adults! That’s >why people hire them… not because they >work for cheap wages.
Yes of course….
The current state of animation speaks for itself.
>Yeah, amazing as it seems they actually GET >kids because they were just recently ones >themselves.
Nope, everyone pretends to know what kids like, while in reality, they are just doing a copy of a copy of a copy what previous shows of the 80´s and 90´s have done. With all the side effects of generational losses.
If you want great animation, then hire the expert first who trains the young animators, enabling them to develop their skills and their styles.
This new idea of ditching everyone above 40 is the straight way to hell for western culture. Not sex and boobs in cartoons.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
I’ve been in the industry a long time, and I’ve heard the same song from the mindless John K. clones for years. Someone says something negative about John K. and the young kids drinking the Kool-aid come out of the woodwork. Are you honestly going to tell me that John has never “borrowed” from anyone else in his own work? I appreciate John K’s work, but let’s not get too crazy here.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
Todd, you hit the nail on the head.
John has pilfered from several artists. John claims that he invented this ‘drooping finger’ that everyone in the 90s was ripping off. BZZT. Sorry wrong, John ripped that off from the Chuck Jones shorts.
Stimpy’s hat design is an exact knockoff of Daffy’s in BEANSTALK BUNNY.
The list goes on and on.
It’s funny, with comic books, swiping is considered a tribute and a common practice, while in animation (especially with John), it’s theft. Of course, nothing is much of a tribute from Mr. Scum the sociopath.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
haha — stimpy’s hat design isn’t original enough for ya? that’s rich!
hit the nail on his own head is more like it… look up “clone” in the dictionary. if you’re going to try to insult at least do one that makes sense. call me a bootlicking john k fanboy or something gay like that. if anything i’m denouncing john k clones. there’s no need to clone him yet, he still walks among us!
if you don’t know where this whole post stems from, look at john k’s blog from a few days ago where he posted a frederator advertisement that completely knocked off the adult party ren and stimpy dvd cover. it didn’t look like a john k homage to me. the point is one of the greatest cartoon directors EVER is not making cartoons because of people like Fred Seibert. And Boo Boo Gone Wild was no failure. Cartoon Network isn’t playing ANY of their good stuff any more. No Looney Tunes, Powerpuff Girls, or Dexter’s Lab(not to mention Herculoids late at night). If the people who were running things in those days were still in charge i think the world would be a much better place.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
akira, who do you think first greenlit powerpuff girls, dexter, and even boo boo gone wild? fred seibert.
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
wow really? cool! i didn’t know that… well in that case, Mr. Seibert probably knows John K better than i… is he hard to work with or something? well for the sake of cartoon fans all over the world can you just try to put up with him again, PLEASE? Pretty please with sugar on top? he’s not over the hill, he’s at the top of his game, and only seems to be getting better. check out the new Tenacioius D video, and “Ren’s pregnant”…
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
Shut up about John K. already. That sh*t’s annoying.
He’s annoying, and certainly had his 15 seconds/minutes already. Ren and Stimpy was his masterpiece, said and done. He’s just a sad, bitter shell of a cartoonist now. Waaah! Waah! f*cking crybaby. Give it up.
stop sucking his d*ck man, it’s embarrasing.
go play on his retarded blog now. bye.
Yooooou EEEEdiots!
On November 3rd, 2006 at 12:00 am
why are you checking out comments under a John K topic then? And um, I think the 15 minutes of fame thing does not apply to professional entertainers.
Speaking of Ren and Stimpy, by the way, why is it that when John K was removed from the most popular cartoon on TV, they couldn’t find any other animation director that could keep it afloat, and the best episodes after John K are based on work developed while he was there? John took the most basic cartoon concept: a cat and a dog and made some of the most original, memorable, and hilarious cartoons ever.
Just imagine if Nickelodeon had treated Spumco the way they treated Klasky Csupo… i think we’d have something better to show for it than real monsters, wild thornberries and all that other crap they’ve made.
On November 4th, 2006 at 12:00 am
Fred, why’d you delete your original post that got John to point his finger on someone pilfering him? Don’t cower to this scumbag.
On November 5th, 2006 at 12:00 am
T.K. I don’t see where I’ve deleted anything, have I? In fact, we’ve gotten quite a few private emails asking us to delete the whole thing, which I don’t really see we should do. John’s been an important force in my life which I state often, and I try to figure out positive things to do with him just as often, akira’s non-informed implications to the contrary. I figure the whole point of blogging is the dialog between people, uncomfortable as it might be sometimes.
On November 6th, 2006 at 12:00 am
Fred, I think T.K. is referring to the posts on the Bronk and Bongo blog, specifically those about the postcard design. Both posts seem to have been deleted with no explanation.
On November 6th, 2006 at 12:00 am
“sigh” I’m afraid Fred has nothing to do with this. I deleted our blog posting because when it was brought to my attention that our card looked exactly like the cover of the Adult Party DVD cover I was stunned and embarrassed and I needed to remove it. It’s not about not “cowering to a scumbag.” as T.K. mentioned. It was a correct and honest observation. It looked like the friggin’ box cover. It was about doing the right thing.
I’m sorry this has opened a whole different can of worms but I cannot stress enough that it was not intentional. I wasn’t out to “steal” from someone and put it on our promotional materials and send it out to an industry that would immediately associate it with something else and cock an eyebrow. That’s like asking my wife and girlfriend out on the same night to the same movie. Trust me, not a bright idea and I won’t being doing that again.
It’s not our goal to emulate something and present it as a new idea. And how foolish is it to do it with a recently released DVD by a popular animator with a legion sized fan base? And further more why would we want our child safe toon even remotely associated with a recently released, mind boggingly mature themed collection of cartoons?
All I can say is that I had bought the DVD weeks prior to doing the design for our card and that the image was obviously, indelibly in my mind when I worked on it. Keep in mind, other than John, there aren’t many, if any, other people who work in this retro style so when I see it, it makes an impression.
I think John K is a brilliant artist with amazing and interesting theories on animation and it’s his out spoken passion for the days of “real” and not processed animation that is inspiring not only to myself but his devoted fan base. And no this isn’t a big, sweaty ” Blow Job.” to sate him or his fans. It’s true; he is responsible for generating interest in the old ways of doing animation. We’d still be watching retina damaging, fluorescent commercial programming like MY LITTLE PONY today if it weren’t for Ren and Stimpy. The animation industry owes him a debt of gratitude, undeniably.
Bottom line is, I made a mistake that I wish someone, anyone, had caught prior to it being posted. I sincerely apologize to all those I may have offended. I’m sorry if I’ve sullied John’s name. I’ve retracted the card before it saw print, removed the posting, am owning up to it and will be posting the new, hopefully “homage” free card soon.
On November 8th, 2006 at 12:00 am
Manny, my personal opinion: you have nothing to be humilated or embarrassed about, truly. No matter what the outcry. Some people have nothing else to do. Homage is virtuous and uplifting.
On November 11th, 2006 at 12:00 am
I agree with Fred manny. No need for you to be ashamed about the post or the postcard. I thought it was a great piece, and loved how it was styled. I didn’t even think of John K. once, before or after, the John K. onslaught.
I also learned something from your post too!
So I still maintain a “great Job” on that postcard. It’s a shame you deleted the post and decided not to go with that art.
Sincerely,
JX!
On November 20th, 2006 at 12:00 am
It looks like I picked the wrong week to try and line up an interview with John K for Channel Frederator.